Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

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Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Calavera » Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:31 pm

My current PC was built around 2012-2013 and while it still runs most things pretty good I think it is time for upgrade. Like usual though I am out of the loop when it comes to the newest CPUs.

My current PC is an i5 3570k 16gb DDR3 and an R9 290X GPU.

I am also far out of the loop when it comes to GPUs.

I'll be looking around on my own but as always I want to hear your suggestions. As for my budget I don't want to go crazy and spend a ton but I've got enough to do a really good upgrade. My PC is something I use everyday so it is worth spending some money on. Especially since I haven't bought much more than another 8gb ram since 2013!

*edit

Ok I've been looking around and it seems like for the CPU that the i5-9600k is the best upgrade for the price.

Intel Core i5-9600K Coffee Lake 6-Core 3.7 GHz (4.6 GHz Turbo) LGA 1151 (300 Series) $199.79

Choosing the motherboard is always a difficult thing to do. I don't want to totally cheap out but I also don't want to spend $200+ on a high end one. This one seems to look decent and is a Z390 chipset which will allow overclocking with the K version CPU
MSI PRO Z390-A PRO LGA 1151 (300 Series) $129.99

Next is the ram. I only need 16gb but just how important is the speed. The board supports up to DDR4 4400 but obviously the higher the speed of the ram the higher the price. I've found DDR4 3200 and 3600 at a decent price. I'm guessing overall I probably really wouldn't notice a difference between 3200 vs 4400.

G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 16GB DDR4 3200 $72.49

G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 16GB DDR4 3600 $83.99

The price difference between the 3200 and the 3600 for the exact same brand is only $11.50 so I'm guessing I should just go for the 3600.

The last component I need is a power supply, I haven't looked at those yet.

The total for the CPU,Motherboard and RAM is around $420. This is just a first draft though.


Now I'm wondering about the AMD RYZEN 5 3600X 6-Core 3.8 GHz (4.4 GHz Max Boost) Socket AM4 95W It is the same price but the Ryzen is newer and has 12 threads vs 6 on the Intel. It also looks like an AM4 motherboard is a lot cheaper.

ASRock B450M-HDV R4.0 AM4 AMD Promontory B450
That one is only $64.99 would that do me alright with a 3600x? Is the B450 chipset decent for that CPU? *edit nevermind on that one. It only supports the 3600x after bios version 2.3 which came out in May 2019. I'd probably get a board with an old bios then not even be able to boot the system to update. So what is the recommended chipset for the 3600x? Probably the damn X570 right? Looks like the cheapest X570 board is $140.


Help me out here guys! Give me a push in the right direction! Buying a new PC is always such a project. I want to be absolutely sure I'm buying the best components for the price.
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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Dr. Zoidberg » Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:03 pm

The Ryzen CPUs are better than the current Intel CPUs.

That Asrock mobo is good (It's the one I've been looking at too) although getting a X570 MB could be the better buy long term because they will run the Ryzen 4000 CPUs that are coming out later this year, the 450 might not.

They are more expensive though.

https://www.newegg.com/asrock-x570-phan ... -_-Product

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Dr. Zoidberg » Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:08 pm

If you are mainly looking at 1080p/1440p gaming, the GTX 1660 is pretty good at a reasonable price.

https://www.newegg.com/evga-geforce-gtx ... -_-Product

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Calavera » Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:21 pm

Dr. Zoidberg wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:03 pm
The Ryzen CPUs are better than the current Intel CPUs.

That Asrock mobo is good (It's the one I've been looking at too) although getting a X570 MB could be the better buy long term because they will run the Ryzen 4000 CPUs that are coming out later this year, the 450 might not.

They are more expensive though.

https://www.newegg.com/asrock-x570-phan ... -_-Product
I'd probably be happy with the Asrock 450 board. I wouldn't be to concerned if it will run the newer CPUs since I'll probably be running this one for many years like my current PC. Since I plan on using this for several years to come would I be better off just getting an X570, most likely the one you posted as it is the cheapest. My main concern with the 450 is not knowing what bios version it ships with. If it is below 2.3 it won't support the 3600X and I'll have no way to update it without a compatible CPU.

With that $140 X570 board, the 3600x CPU and 16gb DDR4 3200 ram the total come to about $420. The same as that Intel build was going to be and probably a much better build than the Intel one for the price. I could switch the 3200 ram out for the 3600 ram for an additional $11.50 but does it really make any noticeable difference? Anything higher than 3600 gets pretty expensive.
Dr. Zoidberg wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:08 pm
If you are mainly looking at 1080p/1440p gaming, the GTX 1660 is pretty good at a reasonable price.

https://www.newegg.com/evga-geforce-gtx ... -_-Product
Yeah I'm still perfectly happy with 1080p. I'm considering possibly keeping my 290x for a bit longer. Even though it is almost 7 years old it still runs the newer games I've tried at 1080p pretty good. I'm not for sure yet though. I'll probably get the new PC first then decide if I really need a GPU upgrade right now. I think the 290x still has some life left in it.
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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by melancholy » Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:40 pm

I will only give advice if you actually do it this time...

J/K, anyway, I second Zoidy on the Ryzen. It beats the i5 in most of its benchmarks and runs cooler while doing it. But yes, if you want all the features of the 3600, you will have to go with the x570. Note that while the Ryzen does beat the i5, it’s not by a whole lot, honestly. In reality, they are both fine processors, so just go with what you want.

As for a video card, might I suggest the Nvidia 1660 Super? It’s just as fast as a 1070 at a very attractive price. Sure it’s a generation behind, but the only benefit of going to the RTX 2000 series of cards is ray tracing and VR. Not to mention the RTX chips has some known problems currently (ones that I myself have dealt with). I’d say go with the 1660 Super and wait a couple more years for them to get the bugs worked out of the RTX line.

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by melancholy » Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:54 pm

Calavera wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:21 pm
I'm considering possibly keeping my 290x for a bit longer. Even though it is almost 7 years old it still runs the newer games I've tried at 1080p pretty good. I'm not for sure yet though. I'll probably get the new PC first then decide if I really need a GPU upgrade right now. I think the 290x still has some life left in it.
I would argue the opposite. That GPU needs upgraded way more than the computer. Sure, it may still run games at 1080p, but it was released before DX12 was even a thing. Pretty much any game made in the Windows 10 era will run vastly smoother on a newer GPU. Hell, I have a friend that still rocks the exact same 3570k processor you have but upgraded to an Nvidia 1060 last year and games fine.

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Calavera » Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:15 pm

melancholy wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:54 pm
Calavera wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:21 pm
I'm considering possibly keeping my 290x for a bit longer. Even though it is almost 7 years old it still runs the newer games I've tried at 1080p pretty good. I'm not for sure yet though. I'll probably get the new PC first then decide if I really need a GPU upgrade right now. I think the 290x still has some life left in it.
I would argue the opposite. That GPU needs upgraded way more than the computer. Sure, it may still run games at 1080p, but it was released before DX12 was even a thing. Pretty much any game made in the Windows 10 era will run vastly smoother on a newer GPU. Hell, I have a friend that still rocks the exact same 3570k processor you have but upgraded to an Nvidia 1060 last year and games fine.
Hmm, now I'm conflicted! Maybe I would be better off to just upgrade the GPU first and see how that does. The 1660 Super is only about $250(actually more like $230) and not only is it an upgrade to the 290x but I'm sure it runs much quieter and cooler than the 290x. I've always had trouble keeping it cool even after replacing the thermal paste and cleaning all dust out of it. Really I don't think the CPU is really what is holding me back. It isn't maxed out and struggling while gaming. Hmm... you've changed my whole idea now!
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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Dr. Zoidberg » Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:53 pm

If you google the CPU and GPU combo you are interested in, people have usually tested them out together, or similar combos.





With the new consoles having good CPUs in them, we might start seeing a jump in what's needed with newer games.

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Skynet » Tue Apr 28, 2020 8:42 pm

Wait, this isn't a thread from 10 years ago? :olol:

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Dr. Zoidberg » Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:35 pm

:olol:

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by melancholy » Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:17 pm

Dr. Zoidberg wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:53 pm
With the new consoles having good CPUs in them, we might start seeing a jump in what's needed with newer games.
Exactly. Unfortunately, Cal, you waited so long to upgrade that in reality you’re gonna have to upgrade everything soon. If you don’t have the money now, then perhaps the best idea is to buy the video card and the AMD motherboard now. Then start saving up for this fall when the new AMD chips release and buy one of those. By doing this, you will get the immediate effect of an upgraded GPU for your old system. And since the motherboard will be good for the next generation of Ryzen, it will sit around unused and give you the ceaseless desire to buy that CPU the moment it’s released.

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by pixel » Wed Apr 29, 2020 2:03 am

Edit: I read the thread again and sort of disagree with myself now. Start off by getting a *1660* while waiting to see what the Ryzen 4000 series is all about. If it supports X570, then jackpot.

Original post:

AMD is still king for gaming PCs for the foreseeable future, Intel is better for specific usages like virtualization and whatnot.

I'd say that the next few months are the best time to buy an X570 board because prices are very competitive to the X470. Here are two quick mockups I did in PCPartPicker where the X570 board is only $31 more:

X470

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600X 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor ($199.99 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: MSI X470 GAMING PLUS MAX ATX AM4 Motherboard ($128.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($73.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 1660 6 GB GAMING X Video Card ($224.99 @ B&H)
Total: $627.95
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-04-28 11:50 EDT-0400

X570

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600X 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor ($199.99 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: Asus PRIME X570-P ATX AM4 Motherboard ($159.99 @ B&H)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($73.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 1660 6 GB GAMING X Video Card ($224.99 @ B&H)
Total: $658.96
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-04-28 11:48 EDT-0400

You'll see that PCPartPicker gives a BIOS warning for that X470, which has been common. If you find a motherboard you like, check the manufacturer's website. More often than not, board makers are staying up-to-date with BIOS updates or at least have an easy way to get a BIOS update to a new board. When I bought my B450 board, ASUS had a program where they would send you a dummy CPU in order to get the system to boot for a BIOS update.

But YMMV, and I'd say that X470 is fine if you find the right bundle deal with a good CPU like the 3600. And of course, it's worth noting that AMD will have the Ryzen 4000 lineup coming soon and it's not known if the X570 would even support the new CPUs. But if you want a great 1080p machine to play AAA titles, the current AMD boards and CPUs should do great beyond the 4000's life cycle. At least I hope so, I've gone all in on the AM4 with X470 and B450 machines :olol:

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by melancholy » Wed Apr 29, 2020 5:01 am

pixel wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 2:03 am
And of course, it's worth noting that AMD will have the Ryzen 4000 lineup coming soon and it's not known if the X570 would even support the new CPUs.
Oh shoot, I thought I read somewhere that it was announced to be compatible. But apparently that was just a rumor. Well, I guess disregard my advice about getting the motherboard now. The rest of the advice stands. Also, when Pixel said to start off getting the 1060, I think he meant to say the 1660. And get the 1660 Super, it’s the same price as the 1660 but comes with GDDR6, so it’ll have a slight advantage.

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by pixel » Wed Apr 29, 2020 5:38 am

melancholy wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 5:01 am
pixel wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 2:03 am
And of course, it's worth noting that AMD will have the Ryzen 4000 lineup coming soon and it's not known if the X570 would even support the new CPUs.
Oh shoot, I thought I read somewhere that it was announced to be compatible. But apparently that was just a rumor. Well, I guess disregard my advice about getting the motherboard now. The rest of the advice stands. Also, when Pixel said to start off getting the 1060, I think he meant to say the 1660. And get the 1660 Super, it’s the same price as the 1660 but comes with GDDR6, so it’ll have a slight advantage.
Yes, totally agree on the 1660 Super. :) Sorry for my typo.

As for X570 boards and Ryzen 4000, the /r/AMD subreddit has talked about it and some say that AMD would be crazy if they discontinued their top-line boards for a new CPU socket. It sounds like AMD was prepared to announce the 4000 lineup in May, but COVID-19 has delayed the trade show until September. :( Who knows what that delay means for the AM4's future, but again, it would probably be a dumb business decision to kill off the X570 line so fast. But never say never, and AMD might use the delay to push a new AM5 socket for early 2021.

Regardless, the biggest feature for the new 4000 series will be DDR5 support. Will that be a big deal for the next 3 to 4 years? I don't really think so, because of all the improvements made to the DDR4 RAM on the market now. The first few years of DDR5 likely won't bring huge performance boosts over the best DDR4 RAM.

If it were me, I'd pair a new GPU with the i5-3570k because it looks like a worthy combo:



The frames are chugging a little here, but Metro Exodus seems like a higher-end test of the hardware. And also, this game is running at high/ultra without the ~15% performance boost from the 1660 Super.

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Calavera » Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:19 am

I'm looking at Super 1660s.

At first I was looking at this one.
https://www.newegg.com/asus-geforce-gtx ... -_-Product

But this one is only $10 more and looks much better
https://www.newegg.com/gigabyte-geforce ... klink=true
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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Skynet » Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:28 am

I'll try not to hijack this thread but it's better than starting a new one.

Quick question, with the fact I now work from home, as well as the fact our bank has dropped our mortgage repayments due to covid, I'm actually saving a fair bit of money.

Is it even worth building a new PC right now? A lot of components are out of stock (atleast locally for me) and if production has slowed down, are prices going to be an issue? Is it worth building now, or should I wait until the world goes back to normal?

Currently running i5-7600k (slight OC enabled), 16GB RAM, 1070 G1 Gaming. I'm finding I do have issues with some games if I want them on high, so some newer stuff I'm dialing back certain settings to have it run smooth.

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by pixel » Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:36 am

Around here in the US, it's a good time to buy. Prices for RAM are at a low right now, especially after all that craziness about 4 years ago. AMD CPUs are priced a little lower because of the new 4000 series on the horizon.

But I don't know how it all translates to dollarydoos. Here's a Ryzen 3600 / 1660 Super build priced for Australia:

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor ($327.00 @ Skycomp Technology)
Motherboard: MSI MPG X570 GAMING PLUS ATX AM4 Motherboard ($299.00 @ Shopping Express)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($150.00 @ Skycomp Technology)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1660 SUPER 6 GB OC Video Card ($421.30 @ Newegg Australia)
Total: $1197.30
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-04-29 11:20 AEST+1000

You might be another candidate for a GPU upgrade while sticking with your current CPU. I couldn't find a benchmark for a 1660 Super, so here's one for the base model and another for the To




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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Skynet » Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:53 am

I actually did think of that, just upgrade GPU for now then get a Ryzen build going later in the year. The good news is I can use this gaming PC for something else. I have a PC connected to my TV which is my last gaming PC, that's used for couch gaming and media server. I do have an arcade machine but that's being driven by an Athlon 3800+, 2GB RAM, 7600GS so I want to replace that. I'll eventually shift this PC to the TV, the TV PC to the arcade machine and ditch the other one. :olol:

I'll weigh up my options for a build as suggested above, or just go GPU for now. Cheers

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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by Calavera » Wed Apr 29, 2020 12:15 pm

I think I 'm gonna go for the whole shebang. I need to do it now while I've got the money or else down the road I'll regret it. I'm look at $740 for everything.

ASRock X570 Phantom Gaming 4S AM4 AMD X570 SATA 6Gb/s ATX AMD Motherboard $139.99

GIGABYTE GeForce GTX 1660 SUPER DirectX 12 GV-N166SGAMING-6GD 6GB 192-Bit GDDR6 PCI Express 3.0 x16 ATX Video Card $239.99

G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 3200 (PC4 25600) Desktop Memory Model F4-3200C16D-16GVKB $72.49

AMD RYZEN 5 3600X 6-Core 3.8 GHz (4.4 GHz Max Boost) Socket AM4 95W 100-100000022BOX Desktop Processor $204.99

Raidmax Vortex Power RX-735AP-V 80 Plus Bronze 735W ATX/12V EPS/12V Power Supply $59.99

Not too bad of a price for a machine that should last me many many years.

I do still have one question about the ram. For $11.50 more I can get DDR4 3600 instead of DDR4 3200. Should I or will it realistically not give me any noticeable performance improvements?
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Re: Its that time again, Calavera computer upgrade advice thread!

Post by melancholy » Wed Apr 29, 2020 12:48 pm

Calavera wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 12:15 pm
I do still have one question about the ram. For $11.50 more I can get DDR4 3600 instead of DDR4 3200. Should I or will it realistically not give me any noticeable performance improvements?
You won’t notice it. Plus that 3600 you referenced has higher timings than the 3200, meaning it won’t be as efficient. So in theory, the speeds will be nearly the same. Save the $11.

EDIT: actually, there’s one other thing you will want. That motherboard supports an M.2 SSD. Even if you have an SSD and are thinking to yourself, ‘I already have an SSD, I don’t need another one,’ I’m here to tell you that your SATA SSD can’t hold a candle to an NVMe M.2 SSD. Just get a 120GB NVMe for your boot drive and watch as Windows 10 boots before the boot circle can even make one complete rotation. They are only like $40, but it’s the single best component you can get to speed up your chosen rig substantially.

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